U.S. DEPARTMENT OF THE TREASURY BUREAU OF ALCOHOL, TOBACCO & FIREARMS

Transcription

1 1 2 U.S. DEPARTMENT OF THE TREASURY BUREAU OF ALCOHOL, TOBACCO & FIREARMS Oil ffl /i\? If TAPE #20 CHANNEL /29/93 5:36 A.M. - 6:38 A.M. 26 TRANSCRIBED BY: Vivian Pena ihjs DOCUMENT HAS BEEN PRODUCED IN CCMH.lAfcCt «,..- RULE 16, FEDERAL RULES OF CRIMINAL PROCEDURE, AND IT IS NOT FOR PUBLIC DISTRIBUTION

2 2 1 (Tape 20 - Side A) 2 LARRY: Let see, here. Hold on. That's 3 the road side, right. 4 WAYNE: Right. 5 LARRY: Okay. All they're doing is justing 6 changing out their, ah, their troops. No aggressive 7 action will be taken. We've talked about that. 8 (PAUSE) Check with your people. They're getting a 9 little antsy. 10 WAYNE: No. They're (inaudible) aiming 11 their weapons up in the air (inaudible) 12 LARRY: Well, they could. But, your folks 13 are getting a little antsy. They have no reason to 14 be, you know, aggressive towards you. 15 WAYNE: We still have the children and we 16 want to get them out. 17 LARRY: Yeah. But, you know, you've ah, 18 you've not, ah, you've not done anything in the past 19 4 hours. Are they ready. 20 WAYNE: I don't know, but I'm I'm 21 LARRY: Let's let's work on it, okay. 22 Let's work on this and, ah, try to get, ah, you know 23 we're not, ah, we're not able to communicate with 24 David or Steve, and, uhm, you know, when we work it 25 together you and I, it worked out. So, check and 26 advise if you would. I need your help in order to

3 1 bring these kids out of there safely. 2 WAYNE: I'll check. 3 LARRY: Okay. Come back to me okay. I'll 4 stand-by right here. 5 (PAUSE - 16 MINUTES) 6 (BACKGROUND NOISE - INAUDIBLE) 7 LARRY: Wayne. Are you there? 8 WAYNE: Right here. 9 LARRY: Okay. How are you doing? 10 WAYNE: Tired. 11 LARRY: Okay. Have you heard anything 12 about what they're planning to do as far as getting 13 the kids out. You know, we're in the second day. 14 WAYNE: We would like to see some daylight. 15 LARRY: Should be getting fairly light out 16 there, should it. 17 WAYNE: Yeah, well except for the cloudy 18 weather. 19 LARRY: Yeah. Is it raining out there. 20 WAYNE: No, I don't think so. 21 LARRY: Okay. (PAUSE) Is it cold? 22 WAYNE: Just damp. 23 LARRY: Hold on just a minute. Did ya 24 ever, did ya ever have a meeting to decide what 25 you're gonna do with the kids. How we're gonna bring 26 them out. Wayne.

4 4 1 WAYNE: I'm waiting for ah, for a report. 2 LARRY: You haven't received that yet. 3 WAYNE: No, I haven't received it yet. 4 LARRY: Okay. Is there anyway you can kind 5 of expedite that. (PAUSE) Is there? Wayne, is there 6 anyway that we can possible expedite that report and, 7 uhm, let us start making some arrangements. Are you 8 there, Wayne? 9 WAYNE: I'm here. 10 LARRY: Okay. Is there anyway that you can 11 do that. 12 WAYNE: You're pretty close to, ah, an idea 13 I heard on the radio. 14 LARRY: You heard an idea on the radio. 15 WAYNE: Yeap. 16 LARRY: Okay, and what is that? 17 WAYNE: It sounded like, ah, sounded like 18 David wanted to wait for daylight. 19 LARRY: Sounded like David wanted to wait 20 for daylight. 21 WAYNE: I don't know if the reporters got 22 it right or not. 23 LARRY: Okay. 24 WAYNE: We're close. 25 LARRY: Okay. Is it on, ah, KRLD. 26 WAYNE: Yeah.

5 1 LARRY: Okay. So you think it, you think 2 what he, David was asking for was daylight then. 3 WAYNE: Sounded like it. 4 LARRY: Sounded like it. 5 WAYNE: I mean it was a reporter. 6 LARRY: Uh hun. 7 WAYNE: Saying that's what Steve and David 8 wanted, I don't know how much the reporter knows. I 9 mean, ah, 10 LARRY: Could you hear David's voice 11 talking with the reporter. 12 WAYNE: Ah, no. The reporter talking to, 13 ah, talk show host. 14 LARRY: Talk show host. (PAUSE) Let's 15 let's work on this deal. What do you want to do 16 about the kids. How do you want to handle this. 17 Same as we did before. 18 WAYNE: The best way. The very best way. 19 LARRY: Okay. It worked out well when we, 20 when you and Byron were moving those kids out, right. 21 You know, nobody was hurt, the kids got out, they're 22 being well cared for. Is that the way you want to 23 try and do it again. (PAUSE) 24 WAYNE: It would be safer with a little 25 lighter out. 26 LARRY: That would get in during during the

6 6 1 evening hours, remember. All-all the kids that left- 2 left during the evening hours. There wasn't any 3 problem. 4 WAYNE: Ah, there was a problem. 5 LARRY: What kind of problem? 6 WAYNE: Ah, the (INAUDIBLE) moving around 7 and didn't know where it was, ah, they didn't know 8 how to meet the car. All of that would have been 9 easier with a little daylight. 10 LARRY: Well, that we decided to do it, you 11 know, in the evening hours. That was, that was your 12 again, your decision. 13 WAYNE: (INAUDIBLE) 14 LARRY: Okay. (PAUSE) Stand-by okay. 15 WAYNE: Okay. 16 LARRY: Alright. 17 (PAUSE - 7 MINUTES) 18 (BACKGROUND NOISE) 19 BYRON: Hello, Wayne. 20 WAYNE: Yeah. 21 BYRON: Wayne, this is Byron Sage. How are 22 you doing. 23 WAYNE: Fine. 24 BYRON: Okay. Ah, Larry said that, ah, he 25 had talked to you a little earlier and that, ah, he 26 had mentioned something about it was, it was your

7 7 1 impression from a, newscast or something, that, ah, 2 David wanted to wait until daylight before we started 3 working on, ah, continuing these, ah 4 WAYNE: I got a, I just got a progress 5 report. 6 BYRON: Oh good. 7 WAYNE: And, ah, apparently there is an 8 agreement with, ah, Jim Cavanugh that ah, he was 9 going to go and get some rest and that they would, 10 ah, resume negotiations with David later. 11 BYRON: Very good. 12 WAYNE: That had reach some agreement to, 13 ah, to delay. 14 BYRON: Okay. 15 WAYNE: It wasn't unilateral. 16 BYRON: Okay. 17 WAYNE: Okay. 18 BYRON: Alright. I'll check with, ah, with 19 our people, with the CP. We got them back on the 20 line and, ah, I'll just, ah, be on the line here if 21 you need anything alright. You doing okay. 22 WAYNE: Yeah, go ahead. 23 BYRON: Okay. I'll just stay on the line 24 here, ah, in case you need anything and I'll touch 25 base with, ah, with the Command Post to see if they 26 have kind of a, of an idea as to a timeframe.

8 8 i WAYNE: Alright. 2 BYRON: Alright. What we want to do is, 3 ah, just like you and I worked out before, we just 4 want to establish a, a mutually agreeable safe 5 transition getting the, ah, getting the people out of 6 there without any, ah, any threat level to anyone. 7 Okay, so I'll be back in touch with you in just a 8 little bit. 9 WAYNE: Okay. 10 BYRON: Okay, Wayne. 11 (PAUSE - 2 MINUTES) 12 (BACKGROUND NOISE - INAUDIBLE) 13 (The End of Tape 20 - Side A) 14

9 9 1 (Tape 20 - Side B) 2 (PAUSE - 22 MINUTES) 3 (BACKGROUND NOISE - INAUDIBLE) 4 BYRON: Hey Wayne. Wayne, are you there. 5 UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: He'll be right 6 back. 7 BYRON: Okay, thanks. Is this Greg? 8 (PAUSE - 5 MINUTES) 9 (BACKGROUND NOISE - INAUDIBLE) 10 BYRON: Hey Wayne, are you back yet? 11 Wayne, are you there? (PAUSE) Hello, Wayne. 12 WAYNE: Byron. 13 BYRON: Hi, Wayne. 14 WAYNE: Yes. 15 BYRON: Yeah, this is Byron. Ah, we got 16 some, uhm, some sketchy information from the CP that, 17 ah, apparently, uhm, there's some preliminary 18 information regarding the identity of the next 2 kids 19 to be brought, ah, out. Do you have any information 20 on that, and, and, how can we start working on it to, 21 ah, make it go smoothly. 22 WAYNE: Sounds like they're working on it. 23 BYRON: Okay. 24 WAYNE: Go with the flow. 25 BYRON: Okay. 26 WAYNE: We'll let you know before they

10 10 1 reach the door. 2 BYRON: Okay, Wayne, we would also like to, 3 ah, if you can, keep us posted as to, you know, what 4 type of plan so that we can coordinate and make sure 5 that, ah, that everybody on the perimeter knows and 6 it can go just as smoothly as possible. If we can 7 get it going, like you and I had it going last 8 evening, then we can just bring this thing to a, to a 9 smooth, safe, orderly, conclusion without, ah, any 10 problems. Okay. 11 WAYNE: Oh, there is one problem. 12 BYRON: What is that. 13 WAYNE: I don't think that they're gonna 14 want to open that door if, ah, if the snipers have 15 there weapons trained down on that door. 16 BYRON: Okay. I don't think that that's 17 the situation, but I'll pass along your concern to 18 the, ah, to the CP, okay. I'll pass that on right 19 now. 20 (PAUSE - 1 MINUTE) 21 (BACKGROUND NOISE - INAUDIBLE) 22 BYRON: Hello, Wayne. 23 WAYNE: Yo. 24 BYRON: Yeah, this is Byron. The CP's 2 5 gotten back and said that, ah, you don't have 26 anything to be concerned of there. There's not gonna

11 11 1 be any type of, of, that type of attention focus on 2 you or anybody in the house, okay. 3 WAYNE: Well, we don't want some to get 4 nervous. 5 BYRON: That's right. 6 WAYNE: Have CP to make sure, he, ah, talks 7 to those guys. 8 BYRON: Okay. We just finished talking to 9 the CP and he's ah, he, I'm sure has relayed that 10 over to, ah, is Dave, ah, DK, is he on the line with 11 anybody now or is it Steve that's talking to them. 12 WAYNE: I don't know which one it is. 13 BYRON: Okay. Well, we'll make sure that 14 they pass it on over there as well. But, ah, I want 15 to get back to you and tell you that that's not a 16 concern, okay. I mean I realize it's a concern to 17 you, but it's not valid. It's not a, it's not gonna 18 be a situation here. 19 WAYNE: 10:4 20 (PAUSE - 5 MINUTES) 21 (BACKGROUND NOISE - INAUDIBLE) 22 (The End of Tape 20 - Side B) 23